It all boils down to what your whole climate is (and your soil and topography), not what zone you're in. As I've reported many times, here in upstate New York's zone 5 (minimum temp -20F), I grow (from memory, probably not 100%): Kniphofias: northiae, caulescens, hirsuta, ritualis, stricta, linearifolia, ichopensis, triangularis ssp. triangularis, breviflora, brachystchya, baurii, multiflora, typhoides, and a few hybrids Dierama: pauciflorum (blooms well), trichorhizum (blooms well), igneum (blooms well), dracomontanum (blooms sporadically) (and I don't find these hard to separate and pot up in spring, just when they're resuming active growth) Moraea huttonii (blooms) Eucomis: montana, autumnalis (several selections, and they're clumping up/multiplying nicely), bicolor, bicolor 'Alba' Galtonia: viridiflora, regalis Gladiolus: oppositiflorus ssp. salmoneus, saundersii, "x gandavensis" (primulinus hybs, whatever - all dalenii hybrids, anyway) Tritonia disticha v. rubrolucens (Very hardy, very free-blooming, spreads vigorously, planted shallow and exposed) Not bulbous: Wahlenbergia rivularis, Berkheya purpurea, B. multijuga, Senecio macrospermus And there are doubntless other South Africans I've forgotten, because they all grow so well, without protection, that I don't pay them any particular attention. So - it just goes to illustrate that "zone 5" is not a terribly helpful concept. Who's to say whose zone 5 is the legitimate one? What I can point out is that, in addition to our world-renowned snow cover, we typically have long wet freeze/thaw cycles in spring, good to adequate ground moisture in summer, and I live on a hill, so that although many of these plants are in liquid mud in spring, the liquid is tending downhill (i.e. it isn't stagnant). The soil here, by the way, is a neutral to mildly acidic clayey loam. So sure, siting matters. But it matters just as much to a lot of zone 3-4 plants. To say you can't grow them in a Kansas or Indiana zone 5 is only to say just that, not to say that, with the proper conditions, they aren't hardy... Ellen Seneca Hill Perennials Oswego NY USA Zone 5 Message ----- From: "James Waddick" <jwaddick@kc.rr.com> To: "Pacific Bulb Society" <pbs@lists.ibiblio.org> Sent: Wednesday, July 14, 2004 9:33 AM Subject: [pbs] A propos Hardy Plants - South Africa style > Dear Jim et al; > I have had so little 'luck' with hardy South African plants I > was getting an inferiority complex. Plants grown from seed exchanges, > plants given to me from growers in various sites and almost every > other source all lingered and failed with VERY few exceptions, > > So I am glad to see this expose'. I have tried a variety of > genera and wish I cold find a reliable Dierama having seen them at > Strybing and found them incredible. > So from your list: G. gandavensis /dalenii does fine. Haven't > tried others. > Crocosmia and related -more duds although I had a Chasmanthe > last one or 2 winters in a really hot dry spot. > > Of course Crinum bulbispermum and I recently reported on a > fluke Eucomis bicolor (but too short to say for sure). > > Most seem a total bust. Am I missing something? > > Best Jim W. > -- > Dr. James W. Waddick > 8871 NW Brostrom Rd. > Kansas City Missouri 64152-2711 > USA > Ph. 816-746-1949 > E-fax 419-781-8594 > > Zone 5 Record low -23F > Summer 100F + > > _______________________________________________ > pbs mailing list > pbs@lists.ibiblio.org > http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php >