In a message dated 9/12/04 9:31:55 AM Pacific Daylight Time, ConroeJoe@aol.com writes: > I wonder if they are particular about warm winters? > Joe ~ Possibly. When I grew this in Minnesota (USDA Z 4), it routinely bloomed in late August whether grown in clay loam or in the pure sand and full sun of the last property. Of course, there the dead weed stems acted as a snow catch and one could count on the wind filtering in some 18"+ of wind-packed snow each Winter. In the latter location (right out in the field with everything else), the only summer water they got were from the occasional thunderstom, yet the row was always a forest of blooming stems. One I did have trouble with under those conditions was L. sprengeri, which seldom bloomed. I now understand that these species/species forms really do prefer more shade and moisture than what it was getting. Dave Karnstedt (now of) Silverton, Oregon, USA Cool mediterranean climate (hot and dry in Summer and cool and wet in Winter), USDA Z 6-7