Hi John, Hymenocallis seeds are ripe when they fall off the scape. They stay green, unless they rot. Size and shape seem to depend mainly on how many seeds are packed into the seedpod. Hope this helps. Jim Shields ************************************************* Jim Shields USDA Zone 5 Shields Gardens, Ltd. P.O. Box 92 WWW: http://www.shieldsgardens.com/ Westfield, Indiana 46074, USA Tel. +1-317-896-3925