Perhaps a note or two regarding patented plants may help. My comments come from my experience with publishing, and copyright info in both USA and Canada ... copyright is slightly different yet using the same underlying principles as a patent. "Resale" and "propagation" and "commercial" all refer to for-profit business. Non-profit organizations can offer books, plants, seed, etc., for sale without crossing copyright -- and as far as I've found out -- patent regulations. Plant patents are also legally suspect. You cannot patent a recipe or technique and the horrible Monsanto cases against the grain farmers aside, some feel the change in the plant is more like a recipe shift than something new or unique (the DNA is not fundamentally changed), and natural self-sowing or seed drift from natural sources are outside the purview of an intent to retail a product. That said, plants can at present be patented. So, I'd go ahead and have that plant sale and seed swap. And remember, though we are not a group of veggies farmers, when it comes to Big Hort: "Control my food, control my politics, control distribution, control my politics." Just my old-hippie-somewhat-anarchistic opinion. Jo Canning Vancouver Island, Canada -----Original Message----- From: pbs <pbs-bounces@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net> On Behalf Of Jan Jeddeloh Sent: Wednesday, June 20, 2018 4:10 PM To: Pacific Bulb Society <pbs@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net> Subject: Re: [pbs] Question regarding commercial advertising While we’re griping about Big Horticulture I’d like to add my gripe about patented plants. I’ve been stung too often by patented pretty faces and have learned that a patent does not necessarily reflect the value or grow-ability of the plant, although it seems like it ought to. Too often big nurseries patent every tiny variation and rush the plant to market. Sometimes it appears they apply for a patent just to lock up the market for a year or two and then stop producing the plant once the word gets out that it’s not a good doer. You go to the nursery, are smitten with the pretty face, bring home your new plant whereupon it promptly dies. I’ve had this experience several times. And don’t get me started on the million heucheras or coneflowers out there. They are sold as perennials but most have an annual life in your normal, less than perfect home garden. You know, the home garden that does not have the mythical well drained, evenly moist soil. Patented plant are also becoming a problem for plant society plant sales. I organize our NARGS chapter participation in the Hortlandia sale and we have to watch that we don’t offer patented plants. As more and more plants are patented it will become harder to find plants we can propagate. Yes growing from seed it great but many of our members want to donate divisions and cutting grown plants. Plant tags get lost and it would be very easy to inadvertently offer a patented plant for sale. I realize plant breeders want to get some kind of return from their investment of time and money but it shouldn’t be too much to ask that the plants be good doers and truly unique. They should also be adequately trailed. One or two years is just not enough. I have found a couple of patented plants that are worth growing. Geranium “Roxanne” blooms all summer, does not spit seed all over and is tough. Salvia “Amistad”, while tender, puts on a great summer show and is much beloved by bees and hummingbirds. It also seems rather silly to patent plants that will self propagated. If it’s going to form a big clump you can easily hack apart gardeners are going to share it around. This takes no real skill. If you want to patent a plant it ought to require a bit of skill to propagate or you will lose the battle of controlling its propagation. To bring this back around to bulbs does anyone know of any patented bulbs? I know Terra Nova at one point had applied for a patent on a Cyclamen coum selection with a Christmas tree marking on the leaves. I wonder if this was denied because it wouldn’t be hard to find look a likes in many groups of coum seedlings. It’s not in their current catalog. Jan Jeddeloh > On Jun 20, 2018, at 9:59 AM, Jane McGary <janemcgary@earthlink.net> wrote: > > I've been purchasing plants and bulbs for about 35 years now. I'm fortunate to live in Clackamas County, Oregon, which has more nurseries than any other US county, so "local" can mean anything from a daphne at the farmers' market to a viburnum from the big Monrovia fields on the other side of the river. I buy some unusual cultivars and rooted cuttings for cutflowers by mail order, mostly from specialty nurseries. Most years I obtain some commercial bulbs for planting out in front of the house -- daffodils to distract the bulb fly from the good ones in back, anemones and crocuses for the bulb lawn, etc. Almost all of my bulb "collection" has been grown from seed. > > I agree with Robin that there's false advertising by large commercial nurseries, but small ones do so as well, especially in exaggerating cold-hardiness. They may not mean to, but if you're growing plants on an island you don't have the same conditions as most of your customers who live 150 km or more inland. Conversely, nurseries in colder areas who keep all their stock in greenhouses may produce plants that are hard to acclimate to outdoor conditions anywhere. Growing your own from seed is likely to result in losses, but the survivors will be easier to keep, and much cheaper. > > Two years ago I had the experience Ellen mentions of buying a shrub that had been bulked up by keeping two cuttings in one pot, but I got it at the farmers' market and the grower told me about it. It's a hybrid daphne; I was able to disentangle the root systems, potted them separately for a couple of months before planting out, and now have two very fine shrubs. This spring I went on a spending spree on Dianthus cultivars. One nursery sent me excellent plants, but another's plants had been in their pots far too long (I repotted them and waited until they recovered to plant them out). I almost never put a purchased plant into the garden the day after I get it. For one thing, you have to watch them for disease. > > As for bulbs that fail, it helps to understand the growth cycles, natural habitats, and structure of the particular species and genera. Bulbs with strong tunics, such as tulips, can stand dry storage much better than those without tunics, such as most Fritillaria. A species native to rocky desert will survive storage better than one native to river meadows. A species native to the alpine zone may not flourish without a long winter dormancy (hence the plants "hardy in Denver" that can't be grown in lowland gardens). It is also instructive to learn how commercial bulbs are grown and processed in the Netherlands, where they can be grown in sand, heavily fertilized, protected from predators, lifted and kept in warehouses controlled for temperature and humidity, and exported in advantageous condition. After a month at Home Depot and transfer to a home garden, they'll likely perform for a year but that may be the limit of their adaptability. Moreover, controlled conditions can suppress the activity of viruses, which may resurface in the home garden; that's why all my tulips are grown from seed, and I buy lily bulbs only from The Lily Garden, which I trust to provide clean stock. > > So read, read, read, and be prepared to lose some plants anyway. You can identify an experienced gardener by their possession of a big bag of plantless labels. > > Jane McGary > > Portland, Oregon, USA > > > _______________________________________________ > pbs mailing list > pbs@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net > http://lists.pacificbulbsociety.net/cgi-bin/… _______________________________________________ pbs mailing list pbs@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net http://lists.pacificbulbsociety.net/cgi-bin/… --- This email has been checked for viruses by AVG. https://www.avg.com/ _______________________________________________ pbs mailing list pbs@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net http://lists.pacificbulbsociety.net/cgi-bin/…