I've written my thoughts to the Board and they will no doubt vote on this. And Jim has withdrawn his proposal so perhaps they won't even need to vote. However I found the discussion very interesting and appreciated that so many people felt comfortable with offering their opinions. Hopefully there will be a way to address the concerns of those people who don't like the name without changing it. We started the pbs wiki in early 2003 and since then it has grown to be a substantial resource on the Internet. It is frequently a first page hit on Google when you are searching for information about bulbs. I've not counted how many pictures we have on the wiki, but I have a list of file names and it is 75 pages long, double spaced and taking an average number of images for each one of those pages, I estimate we have 8400 images on the wiki. Each one is listed on one or more wiki pages with a url that starts with http://www.pacificbulbsociety.com/pbswiki/files/ If you changed the name of the group to something else logically you would retire the domain name and get a new one to reflect the new name and every single one of those urls for the pictures would have to be changed on the wiki pages if you wanted to continue to see them. There is no global way to do it. There would be other things that would need to be changed too. I estimate perhaps 9000 changes would need to be made. Not surprisingly, none of the current wiki helpers are willing to take this on. In addition a lot of other web pages link to the wiki. All of those links would be broken. In spite of the name a lot of people have found this group. The message for the pbs list says: "Welcome to an Internet discussion forum on bulbs, sponsored by the Pacific Bulb Society, for people around the world. Although bulbs (defined more broadly to include all geophytes) are the focus, we recognize that people who grow them probably grow other things too and will be talking about them from time to time." There isn't anything in this description that limits us geographically. But I'm happy to substitute this message with something else if someone wants to provide an improvement. The web site for the Pacific Bulb Society says: "The Pacific Bulb Society (PBS) was organized in Spring 2002 for the benefit of people who garden with bulbs. This includes both cold hardy and tender bulbs, and all the bulbs in between. By 'garden with' we also mean to include plants, shrubs, and even trees that we grow as companions to our bulbs. Membership in PBS is open to bulb lovers around the world. We welcome all to come forward to join us in the celebration of bulbs and in mastering the challenge of gardening with bulbs. " It may be time for the Pacific Bulb Society board to update and perhaps enlarge the mission message. Once again there is nothing in this description that makes this sound like a regional group. So perhaps Jane's take on the word "Pacific" is one we should adopt. People around the world may not know that in the United States pbs stands for public broadcasting system. The funny thing for me is that perhaps because I've written pbs wiki so many times, when I think of pbs now I think of our group instead. Long ago when searching for something about IBS I found irritable bowel syndrome which may be what non bulb enthusiasts think of when they see those initials so it all depends on your experience. I think it may not matter so much what we call our group. It has in it many friendly knowledgeable helpful people who share a common interest. I know my life has been enriched by the contacts I have made and I know so much more now than I did before I became a part of this group. Mary Sue