Hello again: To those of you interested in developing hardier geophytes . I'd be interested in sharing seed, bulbs, bits of knowledge, technical info. and theoretical speculation ,etc. This will be my second year to see what has survived my gentle and not-so-gentle ministrations in efforts to develop some truly hardy geophytes, other than those from the genus Lilium. A slow and tedious business and not particularly suited to one of my age (83) but I do absolutely deplore the attitude conveyed in the recent quote from an unknown Dutch bulb grower cited by Tony. The Brits are a bit less self-centered, but are to some extent affected by a similar provinciality--and not just with respect to plant breeding. The combination of naivete or ignorance coupled with a lack of imagination and disinterest in consequences beyond one's own preciously overvalued first thoughts about a topic can lead either to disaster, or lack of any progress. The recipe for stagnation is simple: If one knows the world is flat, why investigate any further? Is my sentiment here shared by enough participants on this list to constitute a recurring thread, and interrest base? I know who some of you might be--but not others. Adam Fikso, in Glenview, IL ---USDA Zone 5a --running about Z 7 this year. Something like Moscow which got too warm this year and last.