Hi, I have to agree with you Ken, sometimes the virus problem is annoying and daunting as a theoretical problem. However, for the most part, the viruses are not especially rampant and quickly transmitted, and simple precautions (cleaning tools between use, discarding [or quarantining] bulbs with symptoms), can take care of any problem. I also have to agree with you on the notion of frustration. Sometimes I want to grow plants that don't seem to be available from seed or any other way. Sometimes plants I'm interested in cost $50 or more for a small start. I do have to agree however, that folks on this forum have been generous and have provided me seed, au gratis. One source of inexpensive Crinum seed is Silverhill Seeds in South Africa ( http://www.silverhillseeds.co.za/ ). They have Crinum seed for a variety of species, but it is hit and miss--much depends upon the season. Right now, I know they have 2 or 3 (or more) Crinum species seeds for sale. The cost is about $4.00 a packet (5 or so seeds) plus shipping (maybe $4.00). Additionally, Penrock Seeds ( http://www.penroc.co.za/pages/1Intro.htm ) has some Crinum seed available at this time; you have to send an email to see what they have. They are still working on a payment method for folks like me who are unwilling to send a check or money order to South Africa. I'm thinking I will bite the bullet and send an international money order to them for some seeds. Chances for the loss of the money order seem small, but so many South Africans advise that the mail service there is corrupt--it is hard to know what to do. Finally, I know that Shields Garden sells Crinum seed in season, I'm not sure what they have at present ( http://www.shieldsgardens.com/ ). If you remind me (your responsibility), I will be happy to save some C. bulbispermum seeds this coming season and some C. americanum seeds. They don't last forever, but if they are stored at 60-70 F they last for months, especially if they humidity is not low. These plants do very well here, and I think C. bulbisperumum should do fine in your area if you plant it deeply. Cordially, Joe zone 9, low temperature last night was 31 F