In a message dated 8/28/2004 11:10:07 AM Central Daylight Time, "Cynthia Mueller" <c-mueller@tamu.edu> writes: > Do seeds have to literally fall off the plant > before they are ripe? > Hi Cynthia, I'll send a not off-list too, but to answer this question I can only say that I wait for the fruit capsule to change from green to "not green." Sometimes the pod turns yellow-brown, or tan, or sometimes it just turns into a dull gray-green. This is the time I collect the seeds. One other measurement I use, if the pod has not changed color, is the stem. The flower scape sometimes shrivels and looks like hemp-rope even while the pod is still green. I collect seeds at that time also. I like Crinum, but they seem to have their mysteries. I compare them to dogs and cats. Crinum sometimes seem like cats to me, unreadable and unpredictable, but worth dealing with for those who can tolerate the lack of returned affection. Conroe Joe (rain today, was 95 F, now 82 F at 4:00 p.m., 100% humidity for the past 2 days)