On 1 Nov 05 at 11:35, Jim McKenney wrote: > ...let's assume you subscribe to the old concept of clone, > i.e. clone as the group name for all of the vegetatively > propagated progeny of one original seedling. Is saffron crocus > a clone in that sense? Apparently, but there is no way to be > absolutely sure. > > Next, let's assume you subscribe to the modern media concept > of clone, i.e. clone as a group characterized by absolute > (genetic) uniformity. The latter concept is at odds with the original concept of clone. It seems presumptuous for the semantic bandits to have hijacked a term devised by an extraordinarily astute student of cultivated plants, someone who had more knowledge of cultivated plants in his little finger than most everybody else has in their brains. > Triploids sometimes result from crosses of related species. > Another famous triploid crocus is the Dutch Yellow, a hybrid > of, probably, Crocus flavus and C. angustifolius. No probably to it. From Mathew "The Crocus" (1982), p.94: "Cytological investigations into 'Golden Yellow' and its supposed parents have been made at Kew by C.A. Brighton and C. J. Scarlett (1980) and they confirm that it is indeed a sterile triploid derived from these two species, wholly maintained by vegetative propagation." [Mathew gives 'Dutch Yellow' and 'Yellow Giant' as synonyms for 'Golden Yellow'.] -- Rodger Whitlock Victoria, British Columbia, Canada Maritime Zone 8, a cool Mediterranean climate on beautiful Vancouver Island