Patty; Obviously the idea that the red heirloom oxbloods never set seed is a myth. But perhaps something has changed. Reports of cultivated plants suddenly becoming fertile are not uncommon. Presumably the unbalanced chromosome counts suddenly become balanced through some serendipitous cell division that looses the unwanted chromosomes. Since Tony also reported a sudden increase in fertility with new genes in his population it there may be more than one thing happening here. It would be interested to see if some plants reamained infertile while others have become consistently fertile. It would also be of interest to note whether higher seed sets occurred between different clones than similar clones. Even before we know these things we can already conclude the the hierloom oxbloods are no longer totally sterile as the books say. --- patty allen <prallen2@peoplepc.com> wrote: > Robert, > In my post I failed to explain that the heirloom red > oxbloods I have been growing for so many years > started setting seeds several years before I had any > pink oxbloods in my garden. All my reds came from > the same general area in Central Texas. I should > have some bulbs blooming from that first crop of > seeds in about another year or two. > Patty > > -----Original Message----- > >From: Robt R Pries <rpries@sbcglobal.net> > >Sent: Sep 8, 2007 7:31 PM > >To: Pacific Bulb Society <pbs@lists.ibiblio.org> > >Subject: [pbs] Rhodophyela bifida Myths? > > > >I f people have been following the Rhodolphiala > >discussion they may have noted some > inconsistencies. > >As I hinted in my first post the literature tells > us > >there is an oxblood lily that is most common across > >the South that multiplies by offsets but rarely > >produced seed. This red hurricane lily is said to > be > >triploid and from a single introduction by > Oberwetter. > >But note several posts have noyed that they get > seed > >on their red Rhodolphialas when they have other > clones > >such as the pink form in their gardens. I am not > sure > >of when this particular clone was declared triploid > >but there is another explanation that may better > fit > >the facts. Perhaps Rhodolphiala is self sterile and > an > >obligate outcrosser. If all the Southern Reds were > >clones of a single original plant than perhaps > there > >is no seed produced beause it requires a second > clone > >to fertilize it. This would seem a better > explanation > >of fact that the triploid theory that has been > widely > >published. > >--- Robt R Pries <rpries@sbcglobal.net> wrote: > > > >> Lauw; I am glad you made this observation because > I > >> had noticed some of the same behavior. On some > >> Lycoris > >> I noticed "stalks" with a bulb at the base and > >> another > >> formed above the lower bulb. I was having some > >> trouble > >> deciding whether the newest bulb was the upper or > >> the > >> lower and whether the plant was trying to get > >> shallower or go deeper. i have been trying to > >> hybridize Lycoris and dug everything from 1 year > >> seedlings, 2year etc. to my six year seedlings > this > >> spring becaase I am moving the garden. In looking > at > >> the age progression in the seedlings it seemed to > me > >> that they were going deeper and deeper the older > >> they > >> were. I have been reading about Lycoris this > spring > >> and all me references were saying they bloom > better > >> when they are planted shallowly. I was a bit > >> confused > >> becuase the plants seemd to be telling me that > they > >> like depth. The books I was using were zone 7-10 > >> garden writers and my present garden is zone 5/6. > >> Could it be that in colder zones the plant pull > >> themselves lower than in warmer climates. Since I > am > >> moving to a zone 7 I shall plant less deep in the > >> new > >> garden but I am still confused by the action of > the > >> plants. I hope next year to see the first blooms > on > >> my > >> oldest crosses. > >> > >> --- Bulbargence <dejager@bulbargence.com> wrote: > >> > >> > Bonjour, > >> > Rhodophiala bifida and Lycoris radiata (and > >> > chinense) are both in flower > >> > here in the ground When lifiçtng bulbs to sellI > >> have > >> > some interesting > >> > observations about the planting depth. When > >> planted > >> > Rhodophiala shallow > >> > 50-100mm (2-4") it always pulls itself down to > >> > 150-200mm (6-8") to reach > >> > cool and humid layers. Lycoris radiata, I just > >> find > >> > out, does exactly the > >> > contrary: they were planted at 75-100mm (3-4") > >> and > >> > now whenpulling them up > >> > all have formed a secondary bulb at the level > of > >> > 30-50mm (1-2") > >> > One never stops learning! > >> > > >> > Lauw de Jager > >> > http://www.bulbargence.com/ > >> > South of France (zone 8 Olivier) > >> > Coord. Geogr.(GPS): 43°42' 43" N 4° 32' 12" > E > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > Jim Shields: > >> > > Rhodophiala bifida must need fairly extreme > >> > conditions to bloom. They > >> > > probably need hot summers and cold winters, > >> > neither of which Mary Sue has > >> > > at her current home. > >> > > > >> > > We have some Lycoris radiata radiata here > too, > >> > that survive and sometimes > >> > > bloom, but definitely do not thrive outdoors > in > >> > the ground. The diploid > >> > > form of L. radiata does not survive here. > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > _______________________________________________ > >> > pbs mailing list > >> > pbs@lists.ibiblio.org > >> > http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php > >> > http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki/ > >> > > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> pbs mailing list > >> pbs@lists.ibiblio.org > >> http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php > >> http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki/ > >> > > > >_______________________________________________ > >pbs mailing list > >pbs@lists.ibiblio.org > >http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php > >http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki/ > > > ________________________________________ > PeoplePC Online > A better way to Internet > http://www.peoplepc.com/ > _______________________________________________ > pbs mailing list > pbs@lists.ibiblio.org > http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php > http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki/